The reason is because sharpening and edge geometry will also greatly control properties. Its actually quite good, low-cost steel that performs like midprice steel. Heat treatment refers to the heating and cooling steps employed to achieve your knifes proper balance of attributes. Im not hating on 80crv2 , Ive used it. Below shows approximate maximum hardness vs stainless rating for several stainless knife steels. Honestly, yes, because its perfect steel for your knife, besides it depends on which knife, so when youre talking about chef knives, then 14c28n would be an ideal pick thanks to professional corrosion resistance and edge retention. That way you can get into the steel ratings quickly. I have the average composition of the steels rated above (plus some extras) so you can see what the different names refer to. Read more. Vanax gives up some toughness and hardness vs MagnaCut for saltwater levels of corrosion resistance. Three main characteristics differentiate steels from one another: corrosion resistance, hardness, and toughness. s30v [Complete Steel Guide], What is Vg-10 steel?- [Steel Knife Review], The Difference Between 440c steel vs d2: Compared guide, Is 8cr13mov Good Knife Steel [Complete Steel Guide], Amazon Best Sellers in Pocket Knives & Folding Knives. The hardenable grade of titanium (Beta C Titanium) reaches up to 45 or so rc. If you have a favorite steel, rock on! Very much appreciate you. But the true calling card of INFI is its insane toughness. The D2, on the other hand, has a thicker and more durable blade that is better suited for tough tasks like chopping wood or prying open cans. Knifemakers use dozens of steel types to create knife blades. Anyway, astute comment, but edge retention does mean a lot in woodworking. I am just grasping at straws here, but from the data you shared, it seems like toughness does increase faster than edge retention decreases: it is harder to get a very high edge retention knife that will still be somewhat tough compared to a very tough knife that will still hold an edge ok. what does a cvn of 40 v.s 20 mean? Steels like CPM MagnaCut, CPM M4, CPM 4V, and CPM CruWear fit in this category. Rather than upgrade from D2 to M4 or S30V just drop the angle from 40 degrees to 30 degrees. If thats true why do you include it in the stainless steel category? Note:Dont bother with anything less than 8Cr in this series. That is professionaly popular such as the Japanese designation SKD11, Uddeholm Sverker 21, German designation 1.2379, Hitachi SLD and others. Thanks to powder metallurgy, youll find even better edge retention on the high end. 14C28N steel holds good hardness. But weve tested this metal in the form of the Sobata 398 for nearly a year and have been continually impressed. This is a non-powder Japanese steel used primarily in Spyderco knives. 14C28N. Also many hardwoods will dull planer blades just because theyre more dense. Im not sure they answer my question, though, and some of your points dont seem to jive with the info here on Larrins site. Even premium steels can have poor performance with poor heat treatment. Its found on a large number of traditional-style folders. You showed some pictures in this article of the effect on what we might call "effective toughness" of thinner edge angles vs thicker edges in the same steel at the same hardness. Like S90V, its a high-hardness steel, but its more balanced than S90V. There are a lot of different types of steel out there . Its soft, with very low carbon content. thanks thats interesting. Could you please compare it to Shirogami #1 and Agomi #1, I didnt find anything in terms of grain size ragarding thoese steels on the Internert. I just want to thank you for all the work you do for the community and the world at large. There are significant differences between them because 14C28N is stainless steel, while D2 steel is a semi-stainless tool steel. 14C28N is essentially AEB-L (or perhaps more accurately Sandvik 13C26), but with improved corrosion resistance. my understanding is that wood is not a particularly abrasive material and a plane is more of a push cut action than a slicing action so I would have though edge stability and sharpness is more important than edge retention meaning ABE-L should work pretty well. Very obtuse edges resist chipping better but dont hold their edge as long and dont cut as well. In a pocket knife the total amount of steel is rather small. It would be great if you wrote a basic rundown of cryo treatment of knife steels, whats involved, the effects, interactions with other treatments like tempers, alloys that benefit the most, etc. Is this at the same hardness? Though technically not a stainless steel at least 14% chromium, and D2 usually has 12% it's relatively corrosion-resistant. The ratings in this article rate ease of sharpening primarily based on wear resistance, but if a knife is difficult to sharpen, there may be other factors in play. If you look at the chart you may notice that at high toughness levels if you increase edge retention by only a relatively small amount you get very big drops in toughness. are after the ratings. Does that mean that companies like Tops, Kabar and ESEE would be better off using 420HC instead of 1095 on their fixed blades? The 1.4116 I tested has large carbides in it which is presumably the reason for low measured toughness: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2019/05/26/new-micrographs-of-42-knife-steels/. Stainless steels are another subset of high alloy tool steels that have enough chromium in them to have stainless levels of corrosion resistance. However, in our testing there is a reduction in toughness by using the high temperature range rather than the low temperature range, such as was found with CPM-CruWear (Z-Wear) or CPM-10V. I guess the question is whether toughness increases faster than edge retention decreases. Everything you need to know to buy the right knife for the job. High alloy tool steels are designed to be air hardening, so they can be cooled even slower than the oil hardening steels found above. I couldnt find much on 5160 steel and from a knife makers point of view if you are saying youre the preferred supplier of special ops than I dont understand this choice in knife steel. A few steels have been added since such as MagnaCut and M398. If you are looking for a high-end knife on a budget, the varieties of both steel will serve you. You can see that 64 Rc AEB-L has both lower toughness and edge retention than 61 Rc MagnaCut, so I feel that in general you get a better sense of where the steels fit with a single point. just recently the idea occured tome to sharpen a planer blade like a knife and check out how it performs. https://i0.wp.com/knifesteelnerds.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/stainless-toughness-10-19-21.jpg?w=757&ssl=1 BD1 isnt terribly hard but sharpens easily. One such person is Dr. Larrin Thomas, a professional metallurgist raised by a knife maker and a giant knife nerd. Ive found that most makers harden S30V too much, making it prone to chipping at the edge. Maxamets hardness results in incredible edge retention and a nightmarish sharpening and machining experience. G10 Ive not seen these used on non-kitchen knives, though, and it seems that if they had real utility they would be used in other knives as well although perhaps on the thinner edges of kitchen knives they are more effective than they would be elsewhere? The edge retention numbers are normalized to the hardness of the closest toughness test. All rights reserved. But yes, I would assume that the general performance would still be relatively similar between them without evidence to the contrary. 14C28N knives offer better toughness than D2 knives. At the end of the article I gave a list of reasons why I hadnt made my own ratings chart, two big reasons were: 1) I didnt yet have articles explaining what edge retention and toughness even is (this was early on in Knife Steel Nerds), 2) I didnt have good experimental numbers on many steels. Steel softens as tempering temperature increases, but certain steels see an increase in hardness in a certain higher temperature range such as shown below for high speed steels that are designed for this type of tempering: This high temperature tempering can be done for several reasons, such as better resistance to overheating during grinding, or because a coating will be applied to the knife that requires a high temperature. In my experience, it will tarnish and discolor quickly. The steel falls under the Sandvik series of steels and makes one of the 7 steel grades in this family including 12C27M, 14C28N, 13C26, and others. However the 14c28n steel would be great for an EDC knife with typical usage. Rowens heat treat on ESEE knives that use 1095 is exceptional; KA-BARs is less so. Is it similar but worse or better at one of the 3 things? Many knife enthusiasts are concerned with categorizing steels as excellent, good, poor, etc. Low Alloy tool steels have small alloy additions to increase hardenability so they harden more easily in oil rather than water. its like with cars, most of them are not a corvette or a porsche. Quite an eyeopener! On the positive side, they are very easy to forge and grind. the problem is in the innumerable combinations of grades, grains sizes and coatings available. The value being slightly different doesnt mean its an outlier or measurement error. I reserve the right to change my ratings based on new information. I would suggest adding a second axis to the ratings charts that show the data values that the 0-10 ratings are based on (unnotched charpy impact energy, 1% saltwater , Total cards cut, etc.). The excellent corrosion resistance properties of 14C28N are attributed to the high amounts of chromium in its composition. How do its properties compare to other steels? There are significant differences between them because 14C28N is stainless steel, while D2 steel is a semi-stainless tool steel. looking at getting a nice larger flipper for a little under 100 AUD. This is one of the fundamental tradeoffs in steel. Steel with high wear resistance is more costly to manufacture, as the knife company goes through more abrasives to grind the knives. I hope you will find value in the articles on this website. Editors note: This article was first published in May 2015 and was most recently updated on May 25, 2020. can you strike twice as fast with the knife? Are you familiar with anything similar on the metallurgy/knife steel side of things? Edge retention often refers to the ability of a knifes edge to maintain its sharpness during use.

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